What causes the rod bearing to fail on/m1000

WyoBoy1000 · Apr 3, 2012

I ran a pre-mix setup on my piped m1000, ran it 900miles with the BD box. I ran it so the egts read the same as they did when the motor was stock (1150-60*) at WOT. and I ran it a little rich on bottom but like I said not so rich it effected performance, so not enough to wash out the motor like you mentioned.
With a total of 1400 miles I took out a crank bearing, one factor was the delete, the second was I installed a PCIII and it went way lean.
When I tore down the motor the delete had caused some bad wear to the water/oil pump shaft and turned what oil was in the center into a gray film, But the crank side was completely dry, it went so lean to the point every bit of oil and gas was going right past the bearing into the cylinder. I think both where contributing factors. and there may have been more.
When I say lean I'm talking about having to turn my fuel pressure up to 48-49psi and add fuel with the BD box on the bottom to get rid of the bog the PCIII created, it was also pushing 1300* on the egts and I would let off. I had the fuel psi increased and near the same amount of fuel added in the BD box to run the PCIII as I did without it. Road it once with the pcIII and the next I made it 5 miles and failed. The PCIII was removed after that.

The oil I run now wont wash and holds up even when there is very little, it also coats and stays on metal surfaces and doesn't let corrosion happen.

Turbotater · Apr 3, 2012

WyoBoy1000 said:
I ran a pre-mix setup on my piped m1000, ran it 900miles with the BD box. I ran it so the egts read the same as they did when the motor was stock (1150-60*) at WOT. and I ran it a little rich on bottom but like I said not so rich it effected performance, so not enough to wash out the motor like you mentioned.
With a total of 1400 miles I took out a crank bearing, one factor was the delete, the second was I installed a PCIII and it went way lean.
When I tore down the motor the delete had caused some bad wear to the water/oil pump shaft and turned what oil was in the center into a gray film, But the crank side was completely dry, it went so lean to the point every bit of oil and gas was going right past the bearing into the cylinder. I think both where contributing factors. and there may have been more.
When I say lean I'm talking about having to turn my fuel pressure up to 48-49psi and add fuel with the BD box on the bottom to get rid of the bog the PCIII created, it was also pushing 1300* on the egts and I would let off. I had the fuel psi increased and near the same amount of fuel added in the BD box to run the PCIII as I did without it. Road it once with the pcIII and the next I made it 5 miles and failed. The PCIII was removed after that.

The oil I run now wont wash and holds up even when there is very little, it also coats and stays on metal surfaces and doesn't let corrosion happen.

Rite on. That clarifys alot.
Its amazing how much stress a 2 stroke can take with the power they make for their size and yet how fragile they are.
This is a great thread and with all the info thrown out here it should help a lot of guys get better life out of their motors. Or cause mass confusion. lol

m8magicandmystery · Apr 3, 2012

WyoBoy1000 said:
.

The oil I run now wont wash and holds up even when there is very little, it also coats and stays on metal surfaces and doesn't let corrosion happen.

and that oil is..??

WyoBoy1000 · Apr 4, 2012

m8magicandmystery said:
and that oil is..??

I've posted it before and everyone calls it snake oil (including you), even though I have proven otherwise.

https://www.sfrcorp.com/product/protecta-synthetic-low-smoke-2-cycle-oil/

The 2-stroke oil isn't as bullet proof as the oil additive (i e it has to burn and you can't add as much) but on a scale of 1-20, the oil additive makes the oil a 20 the 2 stroke is about a 16 and most all other oils are somewhere around a 4-6. There are some good ones but so far none I've seen that work this good.

for instance
(take 2oz of the oil additive and put in a dirt bike case, you will no longer have a clutch, its that slick, goes the same for limited slips and auto transmissions) (recently my employee added some (4oz gearzol) to a auto transfer case with clutch packs, I had to disassemble the transfer case, , flush with acetone, clean, sand the clutches and reassemble to get it working again)

If you don't believe it thats fine, no need to turn this thread into a snake oil thread its just my opinion and I'm not trying to sell it, just passing along info and its up to you to make that call.

I ran it 300miles in my turbo before I sold it
in my PC 650+miles
my friends are running it (its cheaper)
also a few are running it in 2 stroke dirt bikes, "they" claim more power,???

Again, just "My Opinion"

m8magicandmystery · Apr 4, 2012

i never called your oil snake oil..it was something else i was calling snake oil for fun....your link is the first i saw of this oil..sounds good to me..

about oils causing clutch slipping a person could not use ford atf in a dextron application and vic vesa years ago..the oils were inherently different..,..to accomadate the differance in the materials of the clutch disc...the one atf would make the wrong trannies slip and the other make the discs stick..it was an adhesive base vs slip base that was the major different requirement..

but anyway thanx for the link..

WyoBoy1000 · Apr 5, 2012

m8magicandmystery said:
i never called your oil snake oil..it was something else i was calling snake oil for fun....your link is the first i saw of this oil..sounds good to me..

about oils causing clutch slipping a person could not use ford atf in a dextron application and vic vesa years ago..the oils were inherently different..,..to accomadate the differance in the materials of the clutch disc...the one atf would make the wrong trannies slip and the other make the discs stick..it was an adhesive base vs slip base that was the major different requirement..

but anyway thanx for the link..

You where poking fun and it was about this oil, no worries.
i know how trans fluid works, gm in a ford= slip ford in a gm= hard shift

This stuff etches itself to metal, like a coating of oil that doesn't run off, it last longer and at higher temps. etc.....
I have a lot of examples of but wont fill up the thread. It works and is the only one I found that works this good, or I could even say is better from the other

Hardass · Apr 5, 2012

There is alot of Good reading here i'm glad i asked.

catf1000s/p · Apr 5, 2012

I don't know what you guys are doing with these motors but all i can add is i had a 07 1000 that had 7500 miles in stock form and a 09 1000 that had 10.168 miles and both sleds were traded in still running perfect

WyoBoy1000 · Apr 5, 2012

catf1000s/p said:
I don't know what you guys are doing with these motors but all i can add is i had a 07 1000 that had 7500 miles in stock form and a 09 1000 that had 10.168 miles and both sleds were traded in still running perfect

Ride them like we stole em, in the mountains. Good times!

backcountryislife · Apr 5, 2012

catf1000s/p said:
I don't know what you guys are doing with these motors but all i can add is i had a 07 1000 that had 7500 miles in stock form and a 09 1000 that had 10.168 miles and both sleds were traded in still running perfect

Pretty sure you've stated you ride trails... very different load, very different uses.

Not trying to harass you or anything, but there's a HUGE difference.

I've never heard of ANYONE around here, stock or not, EVER getting those kinds of miles in the mountains.

Don't you work on sleds? You know how big a difference there is.

Qreiff · Apr 5, 2012

Hardass said:
What causes all the rod bearing failures on the cat 1000 motor? What i have seen for failures that are very common are pistons coming apart Which could be avoided some what. But i have a huge amount of rod bearing failure on the crank end of the rod. Is there a way to help make them live longer? also is there a way to tell if your next? thanks

Lack of Legend Performance ZX oils! Really? Really!! No......Really???

Yes........FN.........Really!!!:face-icon-small-coo

catf1000s/p · Apr 5, 2012

backcountryislife said:
Pretty sure you've stated you ride trails... very different load, very different uses.

Not trying to harass you or anything, but there's a HUGE difference.

I've never heard of ANYONE around here, stock or not, EVER getting those kinds of miles in the mountains.

Don't you work on sleds? You know how big a difference there is.

I work on everything, we ride trails for hundreds of miles at mostly 70 to 100 all day for days and days threw the whole season and put a bigger load on the motors when hooking harder most of the day.
I see part of your point to where you guys run wot all the time i guess.
but 1900 miles is just not right unless its harder on the motor trying to make clean hp's being that high up in elevation.
do most of you guys take off the oil injection system and mix fuel?
I would say the crank bearings need more clearance, can't you guy get different bearing with more clearance
lets test this one out in his sled.

WyoBoy1000 · Apr 6, 2012

catf1000s/p said:
I work on everything, we ride trails for hundreds of miles at mostly 70 to 100 all day for days and days threw the whole season and put a bigger load on the motors when hooking harder most of the day.
I see part of your point to where you guys run wot all the time i guess.
but 1900 miles is just not right unless its harder on the motor trying to make clean hp's being that high up in elevation.
do most of you guys take off the oil injection system and mix fuel?
I would say the crank bearings need more clearance, can't you guy get different bearing with more clearance
lets test this one out in his sled.

That statement doesn't make sense. they are roller bearings

m8magicandmystery · Apr 6, 2012

WyoBoy1000 said:
That statement doesn't make sense. they are roller bearings

mine are babbit half shells in my m8..!!!!!.......NOT...lol......

snowmanx · Sep 28, 2014

backcountryislife said:
Woody, mine was a non piped 09 (other mods though) that had never lost a piston. At that point I had never "BLOWN" a belt, I used carlisles, and the second a thread was pulling... I sent it back for a new one.

Got three buddies who lost rod bearings on stock or non piped sleds in less than 1500 miles too... I'd assume they blew a few belts though.

My motor before that one though... I ran piped, ported, full mod, blew belts to the point of combustion nearly every time, blew top ends (CONSTANTLY it felt like to me!! Probably a total of 6 top ends), had a lot of det the first 1000 miles before I was smart enough to avoid it.... and it went 3800 miles, then went in another sled & kept going.

Some people have all the luck. LOL

Yaya, I know this thread is 2 years old...lol

KMMAC · Sep 29, 2014

Glad you reposted it!

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What causes the rod bearing to fail on/m1000

WyoBoy1000

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